358 norma magnum vs 35 whelen

Shaw rifles 24-inch barrel. Can Coolers | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Find More Great NRA Publications Perfect For Every Interest, Discover Everything That The NRA Has To Offer. loaded with a 180-grain Oryx bullet to the .358 Norma Mag. After ten years of not getting drawn I sold it it was too much gun for most of my hunting. Years of development and pushing the limits of what is possible in a rifle optic have led up to this moment. The .358 Norma Mag. Like most of the children of the Holland & Holland parents, the .358 Norma uses its shoulder for headspacing, rather than the belt, as do the .375 and .300 H&H. Any listing you find for H-4895 can be modified by loading only 60 percent of the published minimum to create some very comfortable loads. Out of stock View Details . I have become a 35 cal. I have no experience with the Norma mag. This year, H&R announced an expansion of its AR-15 lineup, bringing additional "retro" models to the market, including a 9 mm Luger-chambered Colt SMG clone, an M16A2-styled rifle and the carbine-size 723. It, as you know, can be loadeddown to be a 35 Whelen but the reverse is not true. I've owned several Magnum Mediums338 RUM, 340WBY, 375 H&H, 375 WBY, 358NM, 338WM. It also notes that the reconstituted Schultz & Larsen company is offering the chambering in its Model 97 takedown rifle. Synthetic wins over laminate because laminates, strongest of all, are also heaviest. cases. There are places where .22 centerfires are legal for elk. Mag. In fact, the recoil of the .358 Norma Magnum, at about 35 ft. lbs. Also as I have a lot of 357 pistol bullets I was figuring on being able to use them as reduced loads/smaller game options in either big 35 cal should I go that route. Now, I have to go out on a limb and say that sensible elk cartridges arent all about power. But there is another Rigby cartridge, vastly overlooked even among rifle cranks, but which was at one time as popular as the .375 H&H Magnum: the .350 Rigby Magnum. Ruger briefly chambered the M77 rifle in .35 Whelen. The softpoints were used for the various antelope species, dangerous cats and even buffalo, while the full-patch, non-expanding solids would be used on elephant. But they are not essential, and despite their effectiveness, all magnums from .30 caliber upwards generate more recoil than many folks are comfortable withand are able to shoot well. R Rocky Coming from me, this conclusion may shock you, so let me give you another surprise. I did secure properly head stamped Norma cases thinking we'd need them going over into the Yukon (no one ever checked). Remington continues to offer factory ammo, and its 200-grain factory load has a muzzle velocity of 2675 f.p.s., while the 250-grain loads muzzle velocity is 2400 f.p.s. Barnes has a Vor-TX load with a 180-grain TSX bullet and a muzzle velocity of 2900 f.p.s. Sure, we experiment a bit with other bore sizes, but in the end it always comes back to the .30 caliber. If you handload your ammunition, it will make feeding a .358 Norma that much easier, just realize you wont find ammunition at a general store, or even at most gun shops, for that matter. The long accepted story was that James V. Howe developed the cartridge in 1922 and named it in honor of his friend, gunwriter Col. Townsend Whelen. of muzzle energy. I believe in quality optics, but quality and magnification are not synonymous. Unlike either the .338 or .375, the .35 (.358-inch) has been a standard American caliber since 1900. To reach the .300 mark, youd need a 270-grain bullet (the North Fork and Woodleigh bullets come immediately to mind), but stabilization becomes an issue in the slower twists, and thats long been a problem in .35-caliber barrels. The first time I ever hunted with a .358 Norma Magnum, it was a custom rifle built on a Mauser Mark X action. The main problem with such potent cartridges is that they kick hard in rifles light enough to carry all day in steep places. Whelen would not. Bottles & 12-oz. Then come the .270s. Quite a difference! For the one perfect all-around elk rifle, Im not sure you can beat the good old .30-06. A monster buck is different from a fork-horn or a fat doe. Heres a look at 10 of the most flexible long-range hunting cartridges. Mag. All in, it weighed over 11 pounds, which is too heavy. 358 Norma runs 250gr partitions at 2810 with Norma 204 powder. Theres more to success than merely landing a good one on the chin. G. Joined: Sep 2009. and the .32 Win. Mag. Real world, the Norma bitchslaps brown bears and moose as convincingly as the 375H&H. .500 Nitro Express. It put an exclamation point on that lung shot. So, I've hunted elk with less ambitious rounds. Powders such as IMRs Trail Boss, Accurates 5744 and IMRs discontinued SR-4759 all work with lighter bullets, and sometimes accuracy is very good, even if the gas seal is not. Compare the .308 Winchester and the .358 Winchester, which are based on the same case, and the .358 wins hands down. It never got up. Opening up a boltface on a standard action is NOT a difficult job for a decent gunsmith and does not affect the strength or viability of the action one WHIT. For anyone with an experimental or fanciful turn of mind, the .358 Norma and the many .358-inch diameter bullets are a gold mine. The .358 Norma Magnum, like the .358 Shooting Times Alaskan, generates a considerable amount of energy, but due to the caliber restrictions for dangerous game of most of the African countries, it falls shy of the markthe .375-inch bore is minimum for many countries. Petersen's HUNTING Publisher, Kevin Steele is in the CZ booth with Dylan Rice at SHOT Show to talk about CZ 600 Series Trail rifle. Movement is more random in big country. it is one nice gun and made for tight places. Shortening the 2.85-inches long .375 H&H case wasnt exactly a revolutionary ideathat little-known .275 H&H so closely resembles the design of the half-century younger 7mm Remington Magnum that its uncannybut with the Winchester marketing machine the concept was brought to the forefront. They truly were ahead of their time, as they were short magnums back when being a short magnum wasnt cool. Thanks for any thoughts. The .35 Whelen is a fine elk cartridge. The cartridge would be championed by Denys Finch Hatton (of Out of Africa fame), John Pondoro Taylor and Pete Pearson, and would be used by Baron Bror von Blixen-Fineke as well. would follow that tradition. The guide professed to be dumbstruck: I never saw a nilgai knocked down like that, he said, And we use some big rifles here!. Honestly, the concept of being overgunned is somewhat mystifying to me, provided you can place the shot. In its 112-year lineage, it has probably taken more elk than all other cartridges combined. lbs. Publisher, Kevin Steele is with Brett Marquardt from Streamlight Inc. discussing the new Streamlight Pro Tac 2.0, the latest edition in the Pro Tac series. All we do know for sure is that it was either Howe or Whelen, or both, who necked the .30-06 Sprg. Also, after a few dozen elk hunts, Ive seen many taken effectively with lighter cartridges. I own several rifles in this cartridge and all my .35 Whelen rifles are accurate. Its still a fine choice, but I dont have a .338 right now. Head to the range this week with American Rifleman staff as they discuss a trim little repeater from Savage Arms that comes chambered for the .22 WMR cartridge. Mag. The .356 Win. That is quite a few cartridges considering that there is not a single best selling rifle cartridge in the bunch. Sadly, my favorite bullet diameter, the .35 caliber, doesnt even rate a blip on the American shooters radar screen. Heeding the advice of American friends, Kvale worked on what would become the .358 Norma Magnum. Here the elk offers hunters an advantage because the vital zone, like body size, is at least twice that of any deer. Its a great gun for moose and elk, bear and boar, and for bison as well. We owe a debt of gratitude to the engineers at the British firm of Holland & Holland; though it is lost to history who exactly designed the belted magnum cartridge, the .275 and .375 Holland & Holland Magnums were game changers. That year, Remington also brought out the Model 673 Guide Gun in .350 Rem Mag. I took it to Texas in 1989 and decked a nilgai at about 90 yards. Blocker Outdoors Finisher gloves, headcovers and other accessories are available in Mossy Oak Bottomland and Mossy Oak Obsession NWTF camouflage patterns to match various turkey hunting terrain. .50 BMG. The .358 Win. I'd go with the 35 whelen. From a 12 twist bore, accuracy sweet spots for light bullets include 2950fps with 180 grain bullets, 2925fps with 200 grain bullets, before normalizing with 225 grain bullets at 2900fps. As Ive said, I like mediums, such as the unpopular 8mm Remington Magnum and the faster .33s. The .35's are just plain superior for CXP3 class game. Yet, that bore diameter produces some of the best hunting cartridges available. Now, I have to go out on a limb and say that sensible elk cartridges aren't all about power. I say that because so many reasonably successful yet hard kicking cartridges have been introduced in the last few years. At 300 yards, it has 19 percent more energy than the .300 Win. [/quote]. On June 26, 1959, Sweden's Ingemar Johansson demolished Floyd Patterson in the third round of their first heavyweight title fight in New York. Too bad Ingemar Johansson was not so well equipped. Though still under construction, Im eager to take the classic cartridge into the hunting fields. .358 Norma brass is a snap to make from 338 Win Mag brass. when fired in a 7.5 pound rifle. The company has chambered several rifles in the cartridge including models in bolt-action, pump-action and semi-automatic. You know the kind with the locking bolt. These include some of my favorites, such as the .358 Winchester and .45-70. I wont go so far as to say thats foolish, but theres a major difference in size and toughness between a cow or spike and a mature bull. Faster 6.5sthe new 6.5 PRC, the old .264, or the super-fast .26 Nosler and 6.5-300 Weatherbywill deliver more energy and open the range envelope a bit. It can be the ballistic equivalent of the .30-06 with a 180-grain bullet or, pushed the other way, it can easily match the velocity of the .300 Weatherby Magnum with the same weight bullet. During the spring conservation order, you can hunt with outfitters from Arkansas to Saskatchewan. Oklahoma. Equal in importance is that you can hit the elk. Since then, I have often recommended medium bores, such as Elmer Keiths favorite .33s, and Ive used the 8mm Remington Magnum a lot. Thats the primary game for many of us, but one size doesnt fit all. By and large, we shooters seem to gravitate to the middle of the road; to bland, yet predictable, mediocrity. It is easy to forget that the .358 bore comes in an extremely varied range of twist rates from 1:16 to 1:12. The .338-inch fans cite the advantage of the higher sectional density figures, while the .358-inch camp favors the better frontal diameter of the larger bore. That version is in some dispute, with evidence that Whelen himself developed the cartridge or at least worked with Howe on its development. Its spawn, the .351 Winchester Self Loader, fared a little better, but it was never in danger of greatness. Either of the other two cartridges mentioned will work just fine also. I have one, of course, and it is fun to shoot, but I would never use it on a serious big-game hunt. The trouble is, they didnt sell. It arrived with three other cartridges designed to compete with Winchesters popular lever-action lineup. The .350 can drive a 250 grain bullet to a MV of 2500 fps. Does the power of the magnum offer much over the whelen in real life terms? Hunting Shack 35WHELEN1N Game King 35 Whelen 225 gr Sierra GameKing Spitzer Boat-Tail - 20rd Box. Make no mistake, the .30-06 is a powerful cartridge, but it doesnt beat you to death and can be built in the seven- to eight-pound range. I will go with the 35 Whelen BUT 9.3x62 will be cool due that you already have a 350 Rem mag, if you're opening the bolt face the 358 STA better option than Norma and 338-06 could be a nice choice too. The Norma factory load, with Normas own 250-grain bullet, performed poorly, coming apart in the chest cavity. So are the .350 Remington Magnum and .358 Norma Magnum. [quote=encorerbHmmm, makes me wonder. Norma loads their 250-grain Oryx bullet to this velocity, and as the rear portion of the bullet is bonded, it will give an excellent blend of expansion and penetration. Today, it is strictly a custom proposition unless one of the original rifles chambered for it can be found. That load actually produced 2825 f.p.s. Also, many of these hunters have the luxury of a long season close to home. Sometimes you get a point-blank shot; other times you need to stretch it a bit farther. Can't really imagine one cartridge doing anything the other couldn't, though the availability of bigger bullets and way more factory ammo (if wanted) are definite pluses for the Mauser. Have all three, and have not shot any of em My medium is a 9,3x62. So it is fair to say that, over the years, .35 caliber rifles at least have caught the interest of the gun and ammo manufacturers, if not the general shooting public. The .35 Rem. Likewise, so do experienced western elk hunters. Why the .35 Rem. All Rights Reserved. Shaw rifle's 24-inch barrel.. in its NoslerCustom line with a 225-grain Partition bullet at 2550 f.p.s. From the Green Goblin (a bolt-action rifle I built on a Remington action), both will produce groups that are sub-minute-of-angle. The recent introduction of a Hornady LeverEvolution factory load for the .35 Remington has usefully improved its ballistics. It was verry expensive to shoot, lots of powder and expensive bullets and brass. I have a .356 Win. Any desire to hunt African dangerous game with your medium bore? With the best loads, my Remington Model 700 is one-hole accurate. Hunting Shack 358NORMA2N Game King 358 Norma 225 gr Sierra GameKing Spitzer Boat-Tail - 20rd Box. In both cartridges, versatility is limited more by the narrow range of bullets available than by any other factor. The Hornady Superformance load for the .35 Whelen launches a 200-grain bullet at a blistering. I am not into the current long-range fad, especially on powerful animals like elk. Common loads fire a 200-grain bullet at 2,800 fps (about 3,480 foot pounds of energy), a 225-grain bullet at around 2,600fps (3,380 foot pounds of energy . Why cant we love the .35? It has never failed me. Here are the features to watch out for. I'm looking for a simpler project on this one. up to 0.358 inches and dubbed it the poor mans magnum.. necked up to .35 caliber. Gun guys recognize the potential in the .358. was designed for the American market, but sadly no American riflemaker ever chambered the cartridge in a cataloged gun. In fact, the recoil of the .358 Norma Magnum, at about 35 ft. lbs. Give a Gift As unmagical as that might sound, it's one of the hardest hitting non-magnum cartridges ever. They have almost all abandoned the cartridge. The .35 Rem. They will also slap down lighter game like deer, feral hogs and black bear with authority, of course. Mag. Powered by UBB.threads PHP Forum Software 7.7.5. But there is no compelling reason to consider a caliber larger than .35. I have needed to reach 400 yards, but never a whole bunch farther. For more specialized uses, Speer makes a 180-grain flatpoint (semispitzer)that, with reduced loads, turns the .358 Norma Magnum into a pussycat for recoil but is easily capable of handling game such as black bears and white-tailed deer out to 250 yards or so. | Kali Parmley of Gun Dog Magazine talks to George Thompson from Benelli USA about the new features from the Benelli line in 2023. There werent many factory .358 Norma Magnum rifles mademost were Husqvarnas or Schultz & Larsensbut many American gunsmiths converted the Mauser 98, Springfield 03-A3 and the like to the big .35, as it made an absolutely perfect choice for those headed north to Alaska. On those gray, moody November days when I am feeling blue I take my Remington Model 141 pump-action rifle in .35 Rem. factory load is a 250-grain Oryx bullet listed with a muzzle velocity of 2723 f.p.s. Its safe to say that of all the .358 Norma Magnum rifles in existence, there are more custom than factory ones, and this makes it tricky to load for in another way. Mag. Griffin & Howe developed the semiwildcat .350 G&H based on the .375 H&H case, as well as pioneering the .35 Whelen. He, too, could have been one of the greats. Let's also compare the .358 with the other end of the spectrum. The ammunition situation is a little better than the rifles. I have built all 3 several times for various customers and owned both the 358 Norma and the 9.3X62. From there, you can work up until you find a load that gives you the accuracy and velocity you want. Size aside, American elk are very tough creatures. Think of the .358 Norma Magnum as the chunky cousin of the .338 Winchester Magnum; not quite as svelte or popular, but equally effective in a fight. No, its not exactly easy on the shoulder, but its not terrible either. Contributor Brad Fenson takes to the grill, to cook up some delicious venison burgers. Publisher of Petersen's HUNTING magazine, Kevin Steele is at the Steiner Optics booth with Alberto Corbetta to discuss the Predator 4 and Predator 8. So when it comes to penetrating thick hide and heavy bone, one could see where the .350 Rigby could benefit from a heavier bullet, say a premium 250-grain with a SD of .279. Cartridges of .25 caliber and below are not ideal elk cartridges, especially if a big bull is a potential. The .35 Whelen fires a larger .358 bullet and is therefore right at the cusp of being a big game caliber and is capable of handling everything except . Pet Loads and Handloader are registered trademarks of Wolfe Publishing Company. Compare practically any small bore cartridge (.32 caliber or less) with a .35 caliber cartridge of similar powder capacity and the result is pretty much the same. Twenty years ago, I might have said .338 Winchester Magnum was the perfect choice for elk.

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